With more people losing their homes, losing their jobs...with the crisis in gas, cost of living, food too high...the crisis affecting that bank in California now affecting the stock market and those people who have lost their money over 100,000, with people returning to gardening, raising their own meat supply, canning and drying...are we entering a new Depression??? Whats your opinion on that???

There is definitely a surge in being more resourceful which isn't a bad thing, but its a tough way to learn it. And it seems that a lot of bad business practices are being exposed for what they really are. Unfortunately this time, more people will be hurt because too many have overextended themselves and depended too much on credit.

 At our house we are in a depression-just starting work after over 6 months, and having to go out of state for that, making do on food that is given to us, not much money for charity, not much budget for entertainment, recreation, or the basics like utilities and car repairs.  I don't see the positives of recession like gardening or family dinners, as one Bankrate article said, I just see uncertainty.  

I think the nation is in a state of flux, careers and lifestyles are being forced to change.  Our jobs that we lost in advertising and mortgages are gone for good, I think, we are trying to be responsive and pick a depression proof field.  I think thousands more people will be surprised as their jobs that are dependent on cheap gas, food, and the middle class go away.  Transportation, restaurants, financial fields, tourism, will all take a hit in the next two years, I think.  Even health care will be affected with more rationing of care.  

I don't know the semantics of recession or depression, I think we are realigning what jobs, energy and food expectations, lifestyles are going to be the new norm.  The new norm will be less than what it has been.  We will be doing less spendng, traveling, commuting, eating, heating and cooling, working in industries such as auto, advertising, finance, air travel.

I'm happy the new norm will be more green, that's about it.  I am spoiled and would like my travel, dining out, driving, and spending to be what they used to be, I'm in a long adjustment phase, as are most Americans, I believe.  

I doubt we're going to see anything like the 1930s. In spite of the media's "gloom & doom" we're in fairly good shape I think, except for the national debt. That may become a huge issue, because the piper will be paid eventually and somehow.

But for the most part I don't foresee people standing in bread lines anytime soon.

 When I work at soup kitchen or food pantry, I am not so sure that we arent seeing food lines now. Tracys experience standing for hours for food is a good example. I know that this isnt as bad as the 30's but it will get worse before the winter is over. People in the NE will be making hard choices.....buy food, heat or medicines. It is already happening here, Babs

I think the technical definition of a "depression" as was seen in the '20s-/'30s has to do with the condition of a certain number of economic indicators (nationwide.) I don't know if we are there yet, but I DO KNOW that some communities, and many households individually are in their own personal economic depressions, and are living the way we all fear if the "real thing materializes according to the economists."

I live in Southside Virginia, and most counties in this area are in a depression if you look at the unemployment rate, foreclosures, low wages, closing businesses/industries, and the rapidly dropping tax base and govt. services. DH and I live as if we ARE in a depression, we have enough, so far...but are learning A LOT, REALLY FAST!--and enjoying it, really.

The one bright point, I think our children and teens, even twenty-somethings who can't seem to leave home and be productive will have to see things a different way. It will make them more ambitious and productive when the bank of mom and dad goes bust.

Keep the faith all, as handling a situation such as this is a personalized, household-by-household affair. Much of it is up to US.

I just wish ALL would remember that CHEATING and STEALING are not acceptable forms of frugality. Watch every bill you get, every paycheck you get, watch insurance companies and banks...I've caught "mistakes" always in "their" favorite in many instances since the economy has taken this downturn. Just CHECK EVERYTHING!!

Ultimately, we do still have some control over ourselves, which may require some learning of additional skills and understanding arcane rules governing our bills. If we don't try our best, we are almost just as guilty of "doing it to ourselves."

Have a productive, educational day and good luck to all of you...I know you are trying! Let's keep the ideas and support flowing, many more people benefit from this site other than the posters. Share what you can..."never, never, never give up" as Winston Churchill said. Teach others and learn from others.

jane

I don't believe we are in a depression. People struggled to afford necessities in the depression era. On a whole, our society is complaining of having to cut back on the luxuries we have enjoyed. I dare say most of us here who are frugal and do the money saving self sufficient things still have some luxuries in our lives.

Many are certainly facing hardships but it's a different kind and I feel as a society, we are still in more comfortable positions than those who lived through the depression. At least for now, it's hard to tell just what tomorrow or next year holds as our economy is dependent on several factors.

 

I don't know a whole lot about economics (other than simple things like supply and demand) but I do remember what I learned about the depression in school. I know we aren't to that point yet and I don't know if we are heading that way or not. But I will say that I won't be suprised either way.

I do see though, from my own experiences, that the idea of the American Dream really changed a lot recently. It use to be that the American Dream was to have freedom, to work hard and have it pay off, to have the "access" to a nice home and a nice life (as long as you worked for it), right to an education, etc. But I think the last couple of generations have changed the idea of the American Dream to a sense of entitlement: people feel like they have the right to have a big fancy house, 2 cars, a boat, an RV, etc. Sure, if you worked really hard and got those things from busting your butt then great for you! But if you just put yourself in a sickening amount of debt to get to that point, have no savings to fall back on, etc. then eventually your "bubble" is going to burst! That is what I see happening right now. I think that times are tough but I think to a certain extent it will make some people wake up. Sure, there are people who (like many of us on this board) are already living very frugally and yet are still struggling just to make ends meet. But I still think that is the minority of the people being affected at this moment. Most of the people that are "freaking out" about the economy are people who are pouting about having to give up their fancy house, cars, etc. that they really couldn't afford in the first place!

My grandparents have a very nice home and 40 acres of land. But they worked hard to acquire that land and started out with a very modest house (more like a small shot-gun house). Over the years, as they could afford it, they added and expanded their home to what it is today (a good size house). My grandfather worked at a plant and retired from there. But at the same time (as working) they had huge gardens, pigs, cows, etc. and produced a good percentage of their own food. They worked very hard for what they got but they didn't get it right when they got married and they sure as heck didn't go into debt for anything. They started their life very small and worked their way up. They understood the need to work for what you wanted rather than getting it handed to you. They remember how things where when they were kids and knew that they had to depend mostly on theirselves. My generation (and even the generation of my parents) have really lost those ideals. They expect instant gratification. They expect to come out of school or get married and automatically have the things that my grandparents took years to acquire. They care more about the image of it all than creating a life you can be proud of and one that you earned. So, that's what I think most people are struggling with now. Our country is getting a wake-up call that I think it may really need. But I just hope that people wake up in time before it gets to the point of being a full-blown depression.

But I think that if gas prices continue to rise, food prices continue to rise, and yes (as one poster mentioned) heating costs continue to be outragous for the winter, things will continue down hill but at a faster pace. Hopefully that wont happen but things aren't looking too positive right now. But I'll admit that I'm a pessimist. LOL. But God continues to work on me and I just keep reminding myself that He will provide for my needs and He won't give me more than I can handle.

God bless,

Julie

I guess for me my beef comes from knowing that the food lines, hunger, choices between food/medicing/heat, etc. have been going on for as long as we can remember and yet only now are we outraged and questioning, "how could this happen?"  (we = society; not the boards!)  The difference in how it's been and how it is now is the fact that it's the middle class being affected.  There are several ppl on the boards that volunteer or have volunteered in the past at pantries or soup kitchens, so they know firsthand what it's like.  I work in non-profit and the people calling for emergency food assistance has gone from being mostly lower income families (90/10) to a mix of lower & middle class families (60/40).  The middle class families are those who have never before struggled and are now facing the challenges of those in the income bracket just below their own.

Maybe it's better to never have a lot of excess; you can't miss over what you've never had, kwim?  I think raising our children from a young age that Christmas and birthdays will not have a mountain of toys is one of the best things we can do.  Taking our kids camping and to parks is better than a trip every year to Disney or a resort.  I went to Disney one time as a kid; my boss has taken her son more than 10 times in 14 years.  Now he expects that or more and she's finding it harder to meet to those expectations.

 

QUOTE:"

I think the technical definition of a "depression" as was seen in the '20s-/'30s has to do with the condition of a certain number of economic indicators (nationwide.) I don't know if we are there yet, but I DO KNOW that some communities, and many households individually are in their own personal economic depressions, and are living the way we all fear if the "real thing materializes according to the economists."

I live in Southside Virginia, and most counties in this area are in a depression if you look at the unemployment rate, foreclosures, low wages, closing businesses/industries, and the rapidly dropping tax base and govt. services. DH and I live as if we ARE in a depression, we have enough, so far...but are learning A LOT, REALLY FAST!--and enjoying it, really."

 Michigan as many people know is suffering from a downward spiral for years now...we've been back here 4 yrs but it was like this before we came here. People are not only losing their homes/jobs, people that never thought they'd need assistance now need it...in Detroit, schools have closed down because people are packing up and moving elsewhere. There used to be a joke...whoever is left in Detroit, turn off the light...that's not much of a joke anymore. I don't live in Detroit but whatever affects Detroit-(jobs/education/industries)-affects me and its getting pretty bad. Its not desperate yet but people are definately feeling desperate.

 I talked to my daughter who is just 11 about going to college. I was an adult when I went back to college and with only a work study income, I relied on Student Loans and Grants for my education. I got a Bachelors Degree but when it was time for me to graduate the jobs had begun to dry up. So, I worked at various other jobs. I never got to use my Degree...{I have a friend who works in a University as a Superviser who is stuck at her job despite having a Masters...she has no choices in her job}...so I talked to my daughter about how she's going to pay for college because federal grants and loans are drying up now...so I can imagine that college will be going back to the way it used to be...only the ones that can afford it will be able to go pretty soon...so I talked to her about getting a trade, working and saving her money and paying to go to be a lawyer....if she still wants to be one when shes grown...the way things are getting for her education, she won't have the same opportunities I had...though still wasn't able to use.

 Even though I raised my daughter primarily frugal, I had bought into the 'excess lifestyle' when it came to my daughter...I didn't buy $100 shoes, or take her shopping to the mall...no she gets thrift store clothes unless absolutely necessary...she gets Payless shoes etc. but she would have games, toys, electronics at a young age for birthdays and Xmas, or just ordinary days. I started her off that way, using what I could buy her as a maker of my success as I think alot of people do...I got the things frugally, she didn't get it when she wanted...it took time to save up for it but she would get it or some type of version of it...we're talking about Ninetindo 2 when everyone else is on 3 or Wii and so now I've had to explain to her that with her age comes reduction and so her birthday she'll get 3 gifts from me, 3 from her grandmother and one from her aunt...now her birthday used to be like Xmas and she's having a hard time with excepting it. She works to help me, she understands frugality but I made the mistake of teaching her that birthdays and Xmas you go all out just like everyone else...and now its come back to bite me!!!